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So break it down real clear for anybody looking to make a purchase from you. What fees and surcharges are you adding on top of msrp. You can call them freight, destination, set up, predelivery inspection or anything you want I don’t really care. There’s only one liar in this convo and it is not me. So try again and start with the truth
 

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I’m taking time to reread these posts now. Did you seriously accuse me of trying to sell boot leg Honda’s? That’s hilarious. That business hasn’t flourished since before I left. But thanks haven’t heard that term in a while. By the way if I was gonna hustle some Honda’s off the books there’s not one single thing you could do about it. You and Honda can kick and scream all you want. It has and will go on long after your gone so don’t ever try to threaten me you only intimidate people who don’t know. But since were on the subject if anybody wants to bootleg some Honda’s or any other bike for that matter I will be happy to explain it to you and show you how to do it. Not as easy as that per say but a basic by low sell high concept not brain surgery. Same exact bikes as this guys selling yours just might end up saying kilometers on speedo instead of mph lol
 

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Since you took the time to reread everything you should know how this is going.

You said "Some of the new stuff I’m not sure but dealer cost hasn’t changed that much although they do seem to be passing on freight now to the customer. Back in the day that was included in dealer cost like $80 bucks sometimes $140 on the jet skis". The rest was a pure mark up" and then I corrected you with "Freight charges up north here are around $400 for most 4 wheelers and almost $1,000 on the sxs."

That should have been that since I'm in the business and know for a fact what the charges are. You then tried correcting me since you know more and say those are PDI charges and I'm confused. I then told you those was freight charges and set up/PDI gets added on as well. It's quit simple and is all added into the second dealer cost of the machine (actual). You also accused us of being thieves since you twisted things. "$ 1000 psi mark up. Wow don’t know how I feel about that one. There is honor among thieves but that is a little excessive." It goes on with your "facts" that you know nothing about and actually tell me how we order our machines. It was all false but you kept going. You also say i don't drive the SXS off of the truck because no one would have fuel in them because the carburetor would need cleaned (another false on your part). Now your twisting things again and trying to say we add everything onto retail when you never asked or know what our out the door price is or how it's figured (all under MSRP FYI).

The bootlegging part came from ".If you are in mid Atlantic region and you don’t mind a little driving I can put you on a guy that’s for real." We are a Honda dealership, we order from Honda. If I was going to do dealer transfers I would do it with my area Honda dealers, which we have. I'm not trying to intimidate anyone, just posting complete facts that happen today in the business. I don't use the forums and never have for our business even though I was told in the past I could. I'm not here to sell parts or 4 wheelers, I'm here to help riders fix their machine and save money.

You do remind me of the type that always has to be right and have the last word, so put your little twists on it and post away.I think your going to fit in great here, you might try going for a staff job to help the forum even more. Good day sir.
 

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I joined here two weeks ago. I have no idea what internal problems this site has nor do I care . Every business has them but why would you start airing your dirty laundry in a public forum. Talking about what the site needs I assure you that isn’t it. Who cares who owns it. Seems that is some source of power or authority trip for you. Old members against new. I thought it was just a website wow. They need to get you out of there like yesterday you are a cancer. I gave you an opportunity to set the record straight but you will still only disclose your freight charge. I asked you what are your total charges on any unit I don’t care pick one. If you think I am some how making a villain out of you speak up for yourself be 100% transparent. But you don’t want to do that. You do realize people can read between the lines right? I stand behind what I’ve said. It is accurate. Folks call this guy and and for a purchase order on any unit. Tell him you need to take it to your credit union. I guarantee a laundry list of fees and doc charges he is failing to mention. I called you out not because you are making a profit but because I think you are taking it to an excess. I think a lot of people are. This unquenchable greed is ruining the industry, ruining a lot of things. You are completely taking a lot of next generation guys out of the game. People reading if you see this guy coming or anyone like him step aside. If you buy a bike from this dude you’re gonna find out why they call him too deep. Don’t say somebody didn’t try to warn you
 

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You know, all Toodeep has to do is hit "ban" and you'd be out of here in a second. You have called him a liar and a crook, which is more than enough reason to do so. The fact that he hasn't kicked you out says a lot about what kind of guy he is.

This forum, along with Hondaatvforums, Rinconriders, and a **** of a lot of others are owned by Vertical Scope. Vertical Scope just changed the format of all of their forums, ignoring the protests of the users (including people like me who were paying members). They did this to make money. The guys like Toodeep do this out of the kindness of their hearts. They don't make money from coming on here and helping people. The site owners are the ones getting rich, and that was fine till they screwed up the layout and started dropping ads, pop-ups, and malware into the middle of every thread. When we protested they said "Tough" so we'll take our clicks elsewhere, and they can watch their ad revenue fall flat because they ignored who ultimately are their customers.

So they did this, and the forum that TBRider linked to is where all of the regulars, who are on this site, Hondaatvforums, and some of the others have gone. The guys who left aren't those who stop in when they have a problem, get the answer, and leave. These are the guys who stick around, the kind of guys who walked me through my first engine rebuild here, step by step, and who send me their phone numbers so that I could call them and get help while I was working. All THOSE guys are the ones who are leaving or have already left, so when TBRider posted up that other forum, he WAS trying to help. The help is all on that other site now. The moderators from the two biggest Honda boards are GONE. They aren't going to be a part of Vertical Scope's game anymore. That other forum was created by a bunch of guys who want NO PROFIT. There are NO ads there. NO pop ups. One very knowledgeable, very helpful former moderator from one of these boards set the forum up himself, and paid all of the expenses himself, refusing to allow people like me to help out in the least.

The site owners asked for feedback, and then ignored it. The supporting members realized that we're just earning Vertical Scope money with our efforts, and they can't even pretend to care what we think, so F them.



So you come on here, talk about how you viewed the industry 15 years ago, and then call Toodeep a crook when he disagreed with you. That guy is one of the most transparent people I've ever seen when it comes to how things work in the Honda ATV dealership business. You call him greedy but in the same breath,act as if you are entitled to new machines at cost. Forget that the people who own these dealerships are trying to earn a living to take care of their families. You used the word "overcharge" like a good little commie. If I feel like I'm overpaying for something, I shop elsewhere. It's call capitalism. The market will drive out those who aren't competitive. But instead you want to act as if you are entitled to a new bike with little or no markup, and apparently are too lazy to shop around and just do the legwork to find the dealership with the best price. All of that to try to paint Toodeep as a greedy crook.

All of this from someone who shows up and obviously doesn't know his @ss from a hole in the ground.

Perhaps you should open a dealership, since it's so easy and common for these dealership crooks to "overcharge".

Perhaps if you're too poor to buy a new bike (I am) then you should instead buy your kid an older machine and fix it up, since you know how EVERYTHING works in the industry. Should be a no-brainer.

A halfway educated person would have nosed around a bit and done a little reading before spouting off.

Better to Remain Silent and Be Thought a Fool than to Speak and Remove All Doubt
 
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