2001 450 es project...neglected machine - Honda Foreman Forums : Rubicon, Rincon, Rancher and Recon Forum
 
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post #1 of 7 (permalink) Old 02-01-2017, 12:01 AM Thread Starter
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2001 450 es project...neglected machine

I found this site a couple days ago, right after I brought a 2001 Foreman 450 ES home. There is so much good information on this website that I had to join. I feel like between this site and youtube I can probably fix just about anything on this ATV.


Notice that I brought A 450 ES home, and not MY 450 ES. This bike belongs to my mother-in-law, and had been used around her property for years, and was often borrowed by family members for hunting trips. However, about three years ago they purchased a side by side, and the poor 450 ES was pushed into the corner of the garage and forgotten about. I couldn't stand to see the bike rotting in the corner of the garage, and I knew it was not in running order, so I offered to take it home and get it running.


When I picked it up, as I expected the battery was done. I suspected the gas in the tank would be bad. So we jumped the bike and got it to crank strong but it would not start. A little starting fluid in the carb and it fired right up...and then died after about two seconds. We pushed it up the ramps into my truck and I headed home.


I am by no means a mechanic, however I have just enough knowledge and mechanical skills to be dangerous. I have worked on jet skis and dirt bikes in my youth so I know my way around these engines...a little bit.


By my deduction, it fired with starting fluid so the problem must have been fuel delivery. I checked the plug and there was plenty of spark. Then I noticed there was fuel pouring out of the overflow tube when the gas was turned on. I assumed at this point I had a stuck float.


That's when I found this site doing some google searching regarding the problem. After a couple days of reading posts I decided it was time to pull the carburetor and inspect it. This is where I ask for the help of the knowledgeable members of this forum.


I've attached some pictures showing what I found inside, a thick green film covering everything in the bowl. The jets have some serious corrosion on them. I suspect that someone put premix in the tank and this is the green film. What do you guys think? My plan is to clean and scrub everything down with carb cleaner, buy a rebuild kit with new jets and gasket, drain and flush the tank, and finish off with all new fuel lines.


I am a newbie with ATVs so any advice and/or criticism is appreciated.
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post #2 of 7 (permalink) Old 02-01-2017, 08:08 AM
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The green slime is probably just old gas. Some low quality fuel stabilizers will do that too, Ethanol blended gas can leave a mess behind too.

A carb rebuild kit is the way to go, it's way easier to replace jets then clean them, plus you get new gaskets, float needle etc.

For ATV projects and crew adventures you can check out my site www.shed-headz.com.

1998 Foreman 450s - not stock
1985 Honda 250sx - in progress
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post #3 of 7 (permalink) Old 02-01-2017, 11:02 AM
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Ethanol gas.


Take the carb apart, put it in a pot with some lemon juice and water, and boil it for about 20 mins.


Take it out, clean it up, and put it back together.

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post #4 of 7 (permalink) Old 02-01-2017, 11:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeepwm69 View Post
Ethanol gas.


Take the carb apart, put it in a pot with some lemon juice and water, and boil it for about 20 mins.


Take it out, clean it up, and put it back together.
before boiling, remove any parts that might melt, or plastic parts, seals and gaskets
so heat and all doesn't effect them, hard parts only really you want to boil!
but does clean very well
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post #5 of 7 (permalink) Old 02-08-2017, 11:32 PM Thread Starter
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Good News, Bad News


The good news first, she's alive. Pulled the carb, stripped it down, boiled it in lemon juice and it looked like brand new. I read some other posts about boiling in lemon juice which suggested washing the parts in hot water with a little Dawn to keep any oils suspended in the juice from sticking to the carb as it dried...so I did that too, it seemed to work.


I ordered the Moose carb rebuild kit from my local Honda dealer. Picked it up yesterday after work but it was too late to start working on the bike. Came home from work today and got right after it. After I got the carb assembled I installed it and filled the tank with fresh gas. I turned the gas on, let the float bowl fill with fuel, pulled the choke and crossed my fingers. As soon as I pushed the start button it fired right up, that's the good news.


The bad news...Although it fired right up, it was running real rough and coughing and backfiring. It seemed to run smoother with the choke on, but really not that smooth at all. At this point I was convinced I had screwed something up. So I removed the carb and went back to the bench. I pulled everything apart, again, checking the multiple pictures I had taken during the disassembly. Everything looked right!


During the disassembly I made note of the idle mixture screw (I think that's what it's called, the one outside the float bowl) setting. It was one full turn out from seated. That is where I set it during reassembly. I backed it out another half turn since everything else looked good and reinstalled the carb. Now the motor was running much smoother, but it still sputtered every two to three seconds, the backfiring is gone.


So I am thinking I need to go out another half turn and dial it in. At the moment I would have to tear it all down again to get to that screw, so I think I'll wait until tomorrow and try to find the proper tool. Am I on the right track here? Do these symptoms sound right for the idle mixture screw being set too tight?


Also...has anyone used the Moose carb rebuild kit before? At the end of the process I had one extra flat washer and one extra O-ring (small). I am hoping Moose included an extra of each because they are so small and they figured a guy like me would drop one on the garage floor and never find it.


Thanks for the help.
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post #6 of 7 (permalink) Old 02-09-2017, 11:21 AM
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I would adjust the idle mixture a little more.

It is possible you still have some trash up in there that you can't see.


I've actually had carbs with an internal crack that you couldn't see, so it was clean, but wouldn't run right (that was on Basfnb's John Deere, not a Honda though).


Try the idle mix screw. If that doesn't work, we'll start over.


And I rarely use anything but the rubber bits and the float needle from a rebuild kit, so if you have an extra flat washer and oring I wouldn't be too concerned.

"The Good One"
2009 Foreman 500FM Green
27" Execs on Rubicon rims, Perfex
Heated grips and Thumb , HID's
5K Viper Max winch

"The Wreck"
2009 Foreman 500FM Green
Perfex with HL springs
27" Mudbugs on Rubicon rims
Heated Grips and Thumb, HID's
4K Viper Max winch

"The Project"
2006 Foreman 500FM Green
27" Titan 589's Perfex with HLsprings
3K Superwinch winch

"Sandy" aka the wife's
2009 475 Rancher AT Tan
26" Mudbugs on Rincon rims
Warn winch. Foreman pod light with HID, SRA gear reduction
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post #7 of 7 (permalink) Old 02-14-2017, 11:06 PM Thread Starter
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I think she's running good now...I think


So here's how my card adjusting went. When I started adjusting the idle mixture screw I was already 1 1/2 turns out. That sounded like a lot since when I removed it, it was one full turn out, so I took it 1/8 turn at a time. First 1/8 of turn and it was definitely running better, but when I turned it off there was a big cough from the exhaust pipe. It's hard to explain the sound, did not sound like a backfire, just more of a cough. So I kept going until the cough went away. I ended up about two full turns out. The smoothness did not change from the first 1/8 turn to 2 turns out. Does this sound right?


On to my next issue, which I knew was coming, electric shifting. When I picked up the bike I was told it almost went to the shop for shifting issues, however when they were about to load it up, it started working perfectly again. My particular problem was that it would not go from N to 1st, it was running good but wouldn't go into gear. I turned the idle speed down a bit and it shifted into 1st. I rode it going up to 3rd gear and back down to 1st, and the shifts seemed harder than I recalled from before. When I went to shift into N, no dice. To get it into N I had to hold the red reverse button down on the hand brake and pull the brake in, then it went into N. Since I was at this point I decided to see if it would shift into R, and it did. Then I found it would not shift back to N. I shut it down and grabbed the manual gear selector tool, I was able to get it back into N that way. And that is where it sits now.


I know there are a ton of posts regarding the shifting problems on these, and I've read a bunch of them. Dielectric grease on all the connections after blowing them out with compressed air. The battery is brand new (two weeks) and sits on a trickle charger whenever it is not running. I check the voltage whenever I unplug it and it has 12.9V - 13.2V. Perhaps a clutch adjustment is in order.


How screwy does this shift pattern sound? Also, do these bikes have to be in N to start? I seem to remember whenever someone shut the bike off in gear we had to grab the gear selector tool and manually put it back in N.


Thanks for the help...I need it
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